[osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

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[osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Abu Mansur
Brother Red1, timing is everything. We will not achieve anything in random rants you know.

Don't spray all your bullets at random (also we need to get invited again and again so we have more info). I am discussing with Hassan about some possible agendas using the OSCC that we will discuss in the group here. Just wanted to get some structure otherwise the con/skype call will be messy. In Sales we have a saying (you are selling something), sales is a process, when it is not a process, then it is a problem. We need to map an action plan with doable milestones. Hope SIG members can take up components of the tasks ahead so it doesn't end up on one person, sort of like a gotong royong thing...

Some of my agenda that I have discussed with some of you:-

The Open Development Model in Government Procurement for software ie projects evolve with OSS license and development process from the very beginning. When actual tender comes out, marks will be given to based on Vendors participation for initial phase. Winning vendor becomes major project sponsor. Recruitment by vendor for developers is also easier as you can see who are the main developers contributing to the project. Less possibilities of lemons (Eg Kastam GST like last time)

The other one is software development on top of SELINUX for government software (I am presenting to govt CIO this coming 10th) to move to more serious stuff in OSS. If we can tie in with activity one of the above and incorporate academic faculty members and students in the development we can kill two, nay even three birds with one stone. The government can really be a catalyst for our software industry by providing a fertile ground for some serious software development through these projects.

More thoughts later (everyone else feel free to rant here) as I am rushing to send my first draft to MAMPU...

On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Redhuan <[hidden email]> wrote:
I think we should brainstorm more often together (while blasting away on four pistons) as i do not think our pitch yesterday sinks in or far. It is better we make a proper presentation as a powerful think tank collectively, to the right office such as KSU and then PM, and collect momentos of 'skull tatoos' along the way.
I like to share what a friend working somewhere up in KLCC Towers who wrote to me a moment ago:

Nor Bahgia B M Nordin
:
"I think anything creative futuristic or game changing breakthrough spearheaded by government servants will fail due to their multiple KPI mentality, and other restrictions.

Entreprenurs/Technopreneurs/Scientist have a ‘no-choice’  ‘do-or-die’ situation, which drives them to do the impossible. It’s a intense single minded focus.

Jobs, Gates, Page and the rest never wasted their time with the government types. They just went ahead and did what they were supposed to do regardless.  

I can tell you this. The road-maps will just collect dust again."



On 7/31/12 9:35 AM, Abu Mansur wrote:
Will need to you to run thru my presso. I didn't do any thesis on this... ;-)

2012/7/30 Slaya Chronicles - Geeko Acolyte <[hidden email]>
How can I assist?


2012/7/30 Abu Mansur <[hidden email]>

Gang FYI... :-)

Mansur

 

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[osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

red1
Ok boss.. though i am just a messenger who always get shot.
Terima kasih atas nasihat ini. Saya diam-diamlah sekarang.

On 7/31/12 10:41 AM, Abu Mansur wrote:
Brother Red1, timing is everything. We will not achieve anything in random rants you know.

Don't spray all your bullets at random (also we need to get invited again and again so we have more info). I am discussing with Hassan about some possible agendas using the OSCC that we will discuss in the group here. Just wanted to get some structure otherwise the con/skype call will be messy. In Sales we have a saying (you are selling something), sales is a process, when it is not a process, then it is a problem. We need to map an action plan with doable milestones. Hope SIG members can take up components of the tasks ahead so it doesn't end up on one person, sort of like a gotong royong thing...

Some of my agenda that I have discussed with some of you:-

The Open Development Model in Government Procurement for software ie projects evolve with OSS license and development process from the very beginning. When actual tender comes out, marks will be given to based on Vendors participation for initial phase. Winning vendor becomes major project sponsor. Recruitment by vendor for developers is also easier as you can see who are the main developers contributing to the project. Less possibilities of lemons (Eg Kastam GST like last time)

The other one is software development on top of SELINUX for government software (I am presenting to govt CIO this coming 10th) to move to more serious stuff in OSS. If we can tie in with activity one of the above and incorporate academic faculty members and students in the development we can kill two, nay even three birds with one stone. The government can really be a catalyst for our software industry by providing a fertile ground for some serious software development through these projects.

More thoughts later (everyone else feel free to rant here) as I am rushing to send my first draft to MAMPU...

On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Redhuan <[hidden email]> wrote:
I think we should brainstorm more often together (while blasting away on four pistons) as i do not think our pitch yesterday sinks in or far. It is better we make a proper presentation as a powerful think tank collectively, to the right office such as KSU and then PM, and collect momentos of 'skull tatoos' along the way.
I like to share what a friend working somewhere up in KLCC Towers who wrote to me a moment ago:

Nor Bahgia B M Nordin
:
"I think anything creative futuristic or game changing breakthrough spearheaded by government servants will fail due to their multiple KPI mentality, and other restrictions.

Entreprenurs/Technopreneurs/Scientist have a ‘no-choice’  ‘do-or-die’ situation, which drives them to do the impossible. It’s a intense single minded focus.

Jobs, Gates, Page and the rest never wasted their time with the government types. They just went ahead and did what they were supposed to do regardless.  

I can tell you this. The road-maps will just collect dust again."



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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Abu Mansur
Err, I you don't have to be too quiet... ;-)

On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 11:05 AM, red1 <[hidden email]> wrote:
Ok boss.. though i am just a messenger who always get shot.
Terima kasih atas nasihat ini. Saya diam-diamlah sekarang.


On 7/31/12 10:41 AM, Abu Mansur wrote:
Brother Red1, timing is everything. We will not achieve anything in random rants you know.

Don't spray all your bullets at random (also we need to get invited again and again so we have more info). I am discussing with Hassan about some possible agendas using the OSCC that we will discuss in the group here. Just wanted to get some structure otherwise the con/skype call will be messy. In Sales we have a saying (you are selling something), sales is a process, when it is not a process, then it is a problem. We need to map an action plan with doable milestones. Hope SIG members can take up components of the tasks ahead so it doesn't end up on one person, sort of like a gotong royong thing...

Some of my agenda that I have discussed with some of you:-

The Open Development Model in Government Procurement for software ie projects evolve with OSS license and development process from the very beginning. When actual tender comes out, marks will be given to based on Vendors participation for initial phase. Winning vendor becomes major project sponsor. Recruitment by vendor for developers is also easier as you can see who are the main developers contributing to the project. Less possibilities of lemons (Eg Kastam GST like last time)

The other one is software development on top of SELINUX for government software (I am presenting to govt CIO this coming 10th) to move to more serious stuff in OSS. If we can tie in with activity one of the above and incorporate academic faculty members and students in the development we can kill two, nay even three birds with one stone. The government can really be a catalyst for our software industry by providing a fertile ground for some serious software development through these projects.

More thoughts later (everyone else feel free to rant here) as I am rushing to send my first draft to MAMPU...

On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Redhuan <[hidden email]> wrote:
I think we should brainstorm more often together (while blasting away on four pistons) as i do not think our pitch yesterday sinks in or far. It is better we make a proper presentation as a powerful think tank collectively, to the right office such as KSU and then PM, and collect momentos of 'skull tatoos' along the way.
I like to share what a friend working somewhere up in KLCC Towers who wrote to me a moment ago:

Nor Bahgia B M Nordin
:
"I think anything creative futuristic or game changing breakthrough spearheaded by government servants will fail due to their multiple KPI mentality, and other restrictions.

Entreprenurs/Technopreneurs/Scientist have a ‘no-choice’  ‘do-or-die’ situation, which drives them to do the impossible. It’s a intense single minded focus.

Jobs, Gates, Page and the rest never wasted their time with the government types. They just went ahead and did what they were supposed to do regardless.  

I can tell you this. The road-maps will just collect dust again."



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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Tajul Azhar
Hi all,

A news from government IT agencies, we are in the middle of proposing what Dr M told us back 16 years ago about IT Centralization in government or IT Governance. Proposal/Paper has been done and being submitted to JPA (Public Service Department), and a few bengkel and meeting will be conducted as a process to be a Department as what Jabatan Peguam Negara or Jabatan Kerja Raja does. 

InsyaAllah, perhaps IT will be exist under one roof, that we call it Jabatan ICT Negara and for brother Red1 and brother Abu Mansur, hope you can have some information regarding this matter when approaching MAMPU.

I don't have any significant idea what will happen when such bill or any proposal will affect us because I think everyone in the government agreed with the BPCM, even though myself personally don't agree with that idea.

Regards





On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 1:13 PM, Abu Mansur <[hidden email]> wrote:
Err, I you don't have to be too quiet... ;-)


On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 11:05 AM, red1 <[hidden email]> wrote:
Ok boss.. though i am just a messenger who always get shot.
Terima kasih atas nasihat ini. Saya diam-diamlah sekarang.


On 7/31/12 10:41 AM, Abu Mansur wrote:
Brother Red1, timing is everything. We will not achieve anything in random rants you know.

Don't spray all your bullets at random (also we need to get invited again and again so we have more info). I am discussing with Hassan about some possible agendas using the OSCC that we will discuss in the group here. Just wanted to get some structure otherwise the con/skype call will be messy. In Sales we have a saying (you are selling something), sales is a process, when it is not a process, then it is a problem. We need to map an action plan with doable milestones. Hope SIG members can take up components of the tasks ahead so it doesn't end up on one person, sort of like a gotong royong thing...

Some of my agenda that I have discussed with some of you:-

The Open Development Model in Government Procurement for software ie projects evolve with OSS license and development process from the very beginning. When actual tender comes out, marks will be given to based on Vendors participation for initial phase. Winning vendor becomes major project sponsor. Recruitment by vendor for developers is also easier as you can see who are the main developers contributing to the project. Less possibilities of lemons (Eg Kastam GST like last time)

The other one is software development on top of SELINUX for government software (I am presenting to govt CIO this coming 10th) to move to more serious stuff in OSS. If we can tie in with activity one of the above and incorporate academic faculty members and students in the development we can kill two, nay even three birds with one stone. The government can really be a catalyst for our software industry by providing a fertile ground for some serious software development through these projects.

More thoughts later (everyone else feel free to rant here) as I am rushing to send my first draft to MAMPU...

On Tue, Jul 31, 2012 at 9:53 AM, Redhuan <[hidden email]> wrote:
I think we should brainstorm more often together (while blasting away on four pistons) as i do not think our pitch yesterday sinks in or far. It is better we make a proper presentation as a powerful think tank collectively, to the right office such as KSU and then PM, and collect momentos of 'skull tatoos' along the way.
I like to share what a friend working somewhere up in KLCC Towers who wrote to me a moment ago:

Nor Bahgia B M Nordin
:
"I think anything creative futuristic or game changing breakthrough spearheaded by government servants will fail due to their multiple KPI mentality, and other restrictions.

Entreprenurs/Technopreneurs/Scientist have a ‘no-choice’  ‘do-or-die’ situation, which drives them to do the impossible. It’s a intense single minded focus.

Jobs, Gates, Page and the rest never wasted their time with the government types. They just went ahead and did what they were supposed to do regardless.  

I can tell you this. The road-maps will just collect dust again."



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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Boh Yap
hi all,

Firstly, I apologise for coming into this late, have not been
following OSDC list much lately, work... then Red1 pulled me into
this.

So gathering some facts from above, here is my rant.

1. Centralized IT

    Need to rethink, centralization offers benefits like economies of
scale, standardisation, leveraging/creating pools of expertise
(building ecosystems)...

    But this has got to be different from the mainframe era, with big
vendors, technology lock-in, proprietry standards and hardware...

    What the 'New Centralization' should be; it should leverage the
latest technology, cloud based computing, ubiqious mobile devices,
prevalent broadband internet.

Why?
----
Centralising computing much as you would cemtralise utillities, like
water, power etc... Such utillities are considered infrastructure,
essential for economic development. Much as our current current
economic strength was due to the foresight of earlier government to
spend on developing the physical infrastructue of roads, ports, power,
water... which in turn attracted DFI (direct foreign investment) which
inturn led to our economic prosperity. That was phase 1, which was
essentially emphasizing on 'hardware' or physical infra.

Phase 2: is about building 'Knowledge based' economy. The enablers for
that is ICT infra, that would allow knowledge and services to 'flow'
just as roads and ports allowed physical goods to flow. Hence
computing resources - as represented by cloud-computing, broadband
(wireless) telecommunications, mobile devices are the way to go.

These, are still 'hard' infra, easy to build, just spend money and do
a bit of planning. The development of the 'soft-assets' is more
difficult, it includes fixing Education, and devloping ecosystems of
IT expertise, SW development, mobile solutions, cloud-computer admins,
network & security... Then you need domain experts..


Easily available infra - leads to innovation
--------------------------------------------

A prominent Silicon Valley VC, in a talk, mentioned the low-cost of
computing leads to the rapid growth of innovation and new start-up
companies. He specifically mentioned the low-cost of PC/laptops and
zero-cost of FOSS. But to deploy and beta-test a product, hosting
costs are still high, particularly in Malaysia. Lowering hosting costs
via cloud based infra, would lower costs further, leverage
efficiencies for wider systems deployment and allow many more
innovators to participate.

Start-ups/innovators can quickly & cheaply develop, test, deploy their
prodctt. Cheaper startup costs allow more people to participate. There
will be a faster cycle, from conception to success/failure. This leads
to a more efficient Darwinian evolution, weeding out the weak,
quickly. (note: failure itself is not a bad thing, it teaches valuable
lessons that lead to success)

Thus you build a healthy eco-system.


How this will help government?
------------------------------
I'll use a 'scenario' to illustrate:

Min. of Health (it could be any other..) has a 'cloud' infra, based on
OSS (e.g. OpenStack) and wants to explore some new solutions,
computerization of the rapidly expanding 1Malaysa clinics...

    They put out a RFP with the following terms:

    - must use FOSS

    - code that's implemented/deployed must be open-sourced
      (not free, and IP rights belong to respective developers)

    - based on open API and standards,
        (for security and auhorization, for data storage
         for data interchange, medical standars...)

    - MOH to define the standards to use, requiremnts specs,
      performance specs, etc... They should not define tools, ie:
      what DB, what language...

    - teams that accept the RFP, to put up a beta/prototype on a server

    - infra will be provided, development servers/tools,
       test servers - all based on MOH-cloud

    (a small fee may be paid to development teams, or it can be made
     into a competition. 200-300k for such a fee for a few million $
     project is not unreasonble. A junket trip arranged by vendors to
     'tour' overseas facilities would easily cost 100k plus! Which
     the vendor already built into the final purchase price! )


    What are the benefits:
    ----------------------
    - create/breed a rich ecosystem of developers/innovators based on
       merits and capability

    - open competition, many teams compete

    - MOH gets to test and evaluate various products
       and picks the ones that are most suitable and works.

    - MOH can even 'mix-match' modules from the different competing
       teams. Because everything is based on open standards, tools.
       ie: Not difficult to port PHP/mySQL app to Python/Postgres
       and vv. Or buld a higher level layer that consolidates data
       into a big centralised database, for centralise reference
       OLTP and reporting, letting the invidual apps' DB handle
       transactional needs.

       (A cost model will have to be determined for the above
        methodology, not unsolvable among the OSS community.)

    - deployment will be really easy, as it was developed on the
      same infra,

    - Procurement is simplified, no need for purchase of complex
      configs, SW license/sizing. Just buy more storage, CPUs for
      the cloud, standard items.

    - Scale-up is a non-issue.

    - Costs will be low, weed out 'lemons', things that don't
       work before implementation (and fix them), not after.


Is the above scenario too idealistic? Not really, its is doable, but
it needs a serious change of mindset!

There are still many 'holes' that need to be filled before the above
scenario is workable,

Care to discuss?,




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regds,

Boh Heong, Yap

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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Muhd Syazwan Md Khusaini
welcome back, boh! glad to see your replies again..I mean it :P
Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device via Vodafone-Celcom Mobile.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boh Yap <[hidden email]>
Sender: [hidden email]
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2012 18:12:26
To: <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO -
 BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III
 - SIRI 3

hi all,

Firstly, I apologise for coming into this late, have not been
following OSDC list much lately, work... then Red1 pulled me into
this.

So gathering some facts from above, here is my rant.

1. Centralized IT

    Need to rethink, centralization offers benefits like economies of
scale, standardisation, leveraging/creating pools of expertise
(building ecosystems)...

    But this has got to be different from the mainframe era, with big
vendors, technology lock-in, proprietry standards and hardware...

    What the 'New Centralization' should be; it should leverage the
latest technology, cloud based computing, ubiqious mobile devices,
prevalent broadband internet.

Why?
----
Centralising computing much as you would cemtralise utillities, like
water, power etc... Such utillities are considered infrastructure,
essential for economic development. Much as our current current
economic strength was due to the foresight of earlier government to
spend on developing the physical infrastructue of roads, ports, power,
water... which in turn attracted DFI (direct foreign investment) which
inturn led to our economic prosperity. That was phase 1, which was
essentially emphasizing on 'hardware' or physical infra.

Phase 2: is about building 'Knowledge based' economy. The enablers for
that is ICT infra, that would allow knowledge and services to 'flow'
just as roads and ports allowed physical goods to flow. Hence
computing resources - as represented by cloud-computing, broadband
(wireless) telecommunications, mobile devices are the way to go.

These, are still 'hard' infra, easy to build, just spend money and do
a bit of planning. The development of the 'soft-assets' is more
difficult, it includes fixing Education, and devloping ecosystems of
IT expertise, SW development, mobile solutions, cloud-computer admins,
network & security... Then you need domain experts..


Easily available infra - leads to innovation
--------------------------------------------

A prominent Silicon Valley VC, in a talk, mentioned the low-cost of
computing leads to the rapid growth of innovation and new start-up
companies. He specifically mentioned the low-cost of PC/laptops and
zero-cost of FOSS. But to deploy and beta-test a product, hosting
costs are still high, particularly in Malaysia. Lowering hosting costs
via cloud based infra, would lower costs further, leverage
efficiencies for wider systems deployment and allow many more
innovators to participate.

Start-ups/innovators can quickly & cheaply develop, test, deploy their
prodctt. Cheaper startup costs allow more people to participate. There
will be a faster cycle, from conception to success/failure. This leads
to a more efficient Darwinian evolution, weeding out the weak,
quickly. (note: failure itself is not a bad thing, it teaches valuable
lessons that lead to success)

Thus you build a healthy eco-system.


How this will help government?
------------------------------
I'll use a 'scenario' to illustrate:

Min. of Health (it could be any other..) has a 'cloud' infra, based on
OSS (e.g. OpenStack) and wants to explore some new solutions,
computerization of the rapidly expanding 1Malaysa clinics...

    They put out a RFP with the following terms:

    - must use FOSS

    - code that's implemented/deployed must be open-sourced
      (not free, and IP rights belong to respective developers)

    - based on open API and standards,
        (for security and auhorization, for data storage
         for data interchange, medical standars...)

    - MOH to define the standards to use, requiremnts specs,
      performance specs, etc... They should not define tools, ie:
      what DB, what language...

    - teams that accept the RFP, to put up a beta/prototype on a server

    - infra will be provided, development servers/tools,
       test servers - all based on MOH-cloud

    (a small fee may be paid to development teams, or it can be made
     into a competition. 200-300k for such a fee for a few million $
     project is not unreasonble. A junket trip arranged by vendors to
     'tour' overseas facilities would easily cost 100k plus! Which
     the vendor already built into the final purchase price! )


    What are the benefits:
    ----------------------
    - create/breed a rich ecosystem of developers/innovators based on
       merits and capability

    - open competition, many teams compete

    - MOH gets to test and evaluate various products
       and picks the ones that are most suitable and works.

    - MOH can even 'mix-match' modules from the different competing
       teams. Because everything is based on open standards, tools.
       ie: Not difficult to port PHP/mySQL app to Python/Postgres
       and vv. Or buld a higher level layer that consolidates data
       into a big centralised database, for centralise reference
       OLTP and reporting, letting the invidual apps' DB handle
       transactional needs.

       (A cost model will have to be determined for the above
        methodology, not unsolvable among the OSS community.)

    - deployment will be really easy, as it was developed on the
      same infra,

    - Procurement is simplified, no need for purchase of complex
      configs, SW license/sizing. Just buy more storage, CPUs for
      the cloud, standard items.

    - Scale-up is a non-issue.

    - Costs will be low, weed out 'lemons', things that don't
       work before implementation (and fix them), not after.


Is the above scenario too idealistic? Not really, its is doable, but
it needs a serious change of mindset!

There are still many 'holes' that need to be filled before the above
scenario is workable,

Care to discuss?,




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regds,

Boh Heong, Yap

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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

Raja Iskandar Shah
boh has a point. will centralisation of ict officers also mean centralisation of services and of ict budgets ?



On Wed, Aug 1, 2012 at 10:01 AM, <[hidden email]> wrote:
welcome back, boh! glad to see your replies again..I mean it :P
Sent from my BlackBerry® wireless device via Vodafone-Celcom Mobile.

-----Original Message-----
From: Boh Yap <[hidden email]>
Sender: [hidden email]
Date: Tue, 31 Jul 2012 18:12:26
To: <[hidden email]>
Reply-To: [hidden email]
Subject: Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO -
 BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III
 - SIRI 3

hi all,

Firstly, I apologise for coming into this late, have not been
following OSDC list much lately, work... then Red1 pulled me into
this.

So gathering some facts from above, here is my rant.

1. Centralized IT

    Need to rethink, centralization offers benefits like economies of
scale, standardisation, leveraging/creating pools of expertise
(building ecosystems)...

    But this has got to be different from the mainframe era, with big
vendors, technology lock-in, proprietry standards and hardware...

    What the 'New Centralization' should be; it should leverage the
latest technology, cloud based computing, ubiqious mobile devices,
prevalent broadband internet.

Why?
----
Centralising computing much as you would cemtralise utillities, like
water, power etc... Such utillities are considered infrastructure,
essential for economic development. Much as our current current
economic strength was due to the foresight of earlier government to
spend on developing the physical infrastructue of roads, ports, power,
water... which in turn attracted DFI (direct foreign investment) which
inturn led to our economic prosperity. That was phase 1, which was
essentially emphasizing on 'hardware' or physical infra.

Phase 2: is about building 'Knowledge based' economy. The enablers for
that is ICT infra, that would allow knowledge and services to 'flow'
just as roads and ports allowed physical goods to flow. Hence
computing resources - as represented by cloud-computing, broadband
(wireless) telecommunications, mobile devices are the way to go.

These, are still 'hard' infra, easy to build, just spend money and do
a bit of planning. The development of the 'soft-assets' is more
difficult, it includes fixing Education, and devloping ecosystems of
IT expertise, SW development, mobile solutions, cloud-computer admins,
network & security... Then you need domain experts..


Easily available infra - leads to innovation
--------------------------------------------

A prominent Silicon Valley VC, in a talk, mentioned the low-cost of
computing leads to the rapid growth of innovation and new start-up
companies. He specifically mentioned the low-cost of PC/laptops and
zero-cost of FOSS. But to deploy and beta-test a product, hosting
costs are still high, particularly in Malaysia. Lowering hosting costs
via cloud based infra, would lower costs further, leverage
efficiencies for wider systems deployment and allow many more
innovators to participate.

Start-ups/innovators can quickly & cheaply develop, test, deploy their
prodctt. Cheaper startup costs allow more people to participate. There
will be a faster cycle, from conception to success/failure. This leads
to a more efficient Darwinian evolution, weeding out the weak,
quickly. (note: failure itself is not a bad thing, it teaches valuable
lessons that lead to success)

Thus you build a healthy eco-system.


How this will help government?
------------------------------
I'll use a 'scenario' to illustrate:

Min. of Health (it could be any other..) has a 'cloud' infra, based on
OSS (e.g. OpenStack) and wants to explore some new solutions,
computerization of the rapidly expanding 1Malaysa clinics...

    They put out a RFP with the following terms:

    - must use FOSS

    - code that's implemented/deployed must be open-sourced
      (not free, and IP rights belong to respective developers)

    - based on open API and standards,
        (for security and auhorization, for data storage
         for data interchange, medical standars...)

    - MOH to define the standards to use, requiremnts specs,
      performance specs, etc... They should not define tools, ie:
      what DB, what language...

    - teams that accept the RFP, to put up a beta/prototype on a server

    - infra will be provided, development servers/tools,
       test servers - all based on MOH-cloud

    (a small fee may be paid to development teams, or it can be made
     into a competition. 200-300k for such a fee for a few million $
     project is not unreasonble. A junket trip arranged by vendors to
     'tour' overseas facilities would easily cost 100k plus! Which
     the vendor already built into the final purchase price! )


    What are the benefits:
    ----------------------
    - create/breed a rich ecosystem of developers/innovators based on
       merits and capability

    - open competition, many teams compete

    - MOH gets to test and evaluate various products
       and picks the ones that are most suitable and works.

    - MOH can even 'mix-match' modules from the different competing
       teams. Because everything is based on open standards, tools.
       ie: Not difficult to port PHP/mySQL app to Python/Postgres
       and vv. Or buld a higher level layer that consolidates data
       into a big centralised database, for centralise reference
       OLTP and reporting, letting the invidual apps' DB handle
       transactional needs.

       (A cost model will have to be determined for the above
        methodology, not unsolvable among the OSS community.)

    - deployment will be really easy, as it was developed on the
      same infra,

    - Procurement is simplified, no need for purchase of complex
      configs, SW license/sizing. Just buy more storage, CPUs for
      the cloud, standard items.

    - Scale-up is a non-issue.

    - Costs will be low, weed out 'lemons', things that don't
       work before implementation (and fix them), not after.


Is the above scenario too idealistic? Not really, its is doable, but
it needs a serious change of mindset!

There are still many 'holes' that need to be filled before the above
scenario is workable,

Care to discuss?,




--
#-------
regds,

Boh Heong, Yap

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Malaysia Open Source Conference 2012
MOSC2012 http://portal.mosc.my/

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Malaysia Open Source Conference 2012
MOSC2012 http://portal.mosc.my/

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[osdcmy] Cloud 2020

red1
Bagi mereka yang baru dalam Pengkomputeran Awan seperti saya, bolehlah
membuat lonjakan ilmiah dengan membaca
http://www.zdnet.com/cloud-computing-10-ways-it-will-change-by-2020-7000001808/

Menurut artikel ini, dalam tahun 2020, seseorang CIO tidak akan mengenal
apa dia infrastructure. Semua akan hilang dalam kelompok awan. Aplikasi
akan bertambah canggih, mampu digerakkan dari awan ke awan dalam bentuk
servis.

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Re: [osdcmy] Re: JEMPUTAN SEBAGAI PEMBENTANG DI SESI EKSKLUSIF CIO - BENGKEL SELF RELIANCE PROGRAM OPEN SOURCE SOFTWARE (OSS) SEKTOR AWAM FASA III - SIRI 3

E A Faisal
In reply to this post by Boh Yap

I like the infra part. Many of us are 'researchers' who just dont have big enough pocket. If only there's some kind of 'public campus' for us to use without having breaking arms and legs. For instance I'm particularly interested to test and expand some ideas on immunological cloud infra (since Boh uses health as example).

On Jul 31, 2012 6:12 PM, "Boh Yap" <[hidden email]> wrote:
hi all,

Firstly, I apologise for coming into this late, have not been
following OSDC list much lately, work... then Red1 pulled me into
this.

So gathering some facts from above, here is my rant.

1. Centralized IT

    Need to rethink, centralization offers benefits like economies of
scale, standardisation, leveraging/creating pools of expertise
(building ecosystems)...

    But this has got to be different from the mainframe era, with big
vendors, technology lock-in, proprietry standards and hardware...

    What the 'New Centralization' should be; it should leverage the
latest technology, cloud based computing, ubiqious mobile devices,
prevalent broadband internet.

Why?
----
Centralising computing much as you would cemtralise utillities, like
water, power etc... Such utillities are considered infrastructure,
essential for economic development. Much as our current current
economic strength was due to the foresight of earlier government to
spend on developing the physical infrastructue of roads, ports, power,
water... which in turn attracted DFI (direct foreign investment) which
inturn led to our economic prosperity. That was phase 1, which was
essentially emphasizing on 'hardware' or physical infra.

Phase 2: is about building 'Knowledge based' economy. The enablers for
that is ICT infra, that would allow knowledge and services to 'flow'
just as roads and ports allowed physical goods to flow. Hence
computing resources - as represented by cloud-computing, broadband
(wireless) telecommunications, mobile devices are the way to go.

These, are still 'hard' infra, easy to build, just spend money and do
a bit of planning. The development of the 'soft-assets' is more
difficult, it includes fixing Education, and devloping ecosystems of
IT expertise, SW development, mobile solutions, cloud-computer admins,
network & security... Then you need domain experts..


Easily available infra - leads to innovation
--------------------------------------------

A prominent Silicon Valley VC, in a talk, mentioned the low-cost of
computing leads to the rapid growth of innovation and new start-up
companies. He specifically mentioned the low-cost of PC/laptops and
zero-cost of FOSS. But to deploy and beta-test a product, hosting
costs are still high, particularly in Malaysia. Lowering hosting costs
via cloud based infra, would lower costs further, leverage
efficiencies for wider systems deployment and allow many more
innovators to participate.

Start-ups/innovators can quickly & cheaply develop, test, deploy their
prodctt. Cheaper startup costs allow more people to participate. There
will be a faster cycle, from conception to success/failure. This leads
to a more efficient Darwinian evolution, weeding out the weak,
quickly. (note: failure itself is not a bad thing, it teaches valuable
lessons that lead to success)

Thus you build a healthy eco-system.


How this will help government?
------------------------------
I'll use a 'scenario' to illustrate:

Min. of Health (it could be any other..) has a 'cloud' infra, based on
OSS (e.g. OpenStack) and wants to explore some new solutions,
computerization of the rapidly expanding 1Malaysa clinics...

    They put out a RFP with the following terms:

    - must use FOSS

    - code that's implemented/deployed must be open-sourced
      (not free, and IP rights belong to respective developers)

    - based on open API and standards,
        (for security and auhorization, for data storage
         for data interchange, medical standars...)

    - MOH to define the standards to use, requiremnts specs,
      performance specs, etc... They should not define tools, ie:
      what DB, what language...

    - teams that accept the RFP, to put up a beta/prototype on a server

    - infra will be provided, development servers/tools,
       test servers - all based on MOH-cloud

    (a small fee may be paid to development teams, or it can be made
     into a competition. 200-300k for such a fee for a few million $
     project is not unreasonble. A junket trip arranged by vendors to
     'tour' overseas facilities would easily cost 100k plus! Which
     the vendor already built into the final purchase price! )


    What are the benefits:
    ----------------------
    - create/breed a rich ecosystem of developers/innovators based on
       merits and capability

    - open competition, many teams compete

    - MOH gets to test and evaluate various products
       and picks the ones that are most suitable and works.

    - MOH can even 'mix-match' modules from the different competing
       teams. Because everything is based on open standards, tools.
       ie: Not difficult to port PHP/mySQL app to Python/Postgres
       and vv. Or buld a higher level layer that consolidates data
       into a big centralised database, for centralise reference
       OLTP and reporting, letting the invidual apps' DB handle
       transactional needs.

       (A cost model will have to be determined for the above
        methodology, not unsolvable among the OSS community.)

    - deployment will be really easy, as it was developed on the
      same infra,

    - Procurement is simplified, no need for purchase of complex
      configs, SW license/sizing. Just buy more storage, CPUs for
      the cloud, standard items.

    - Scale-up is a non-issue.

    - Costs will be low, weed out 'lemons', things that don't
       work before implementation (and fix them), not after.


Is the above scenario too idealistic? Not really, its is doable, but
it needs a serious change of mindset!

There are still many 'holes' that need to be filled before the above
scenario is workable,

Care to discuss?,




--
#-------
regds,

Boh Heong, Yap

--
To unsubscribe from and detail about this group http://portal.mosc.my/osdc-my-mailing-list-information

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http://www.facebook.com/groups/osdcmalaysia/

Malaysia Open Source Conference 2012
MOSC2012 http://portal.mosc.my/

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Malaysia Open Source Conference 2012
MOSC2012 http://portal.mosc.my/